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Xileria

Glorious Ring

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On 12/2/2019 at 2:15 PM, Xileria said:


To be honest you really prolly understand the point but your judgement is clouded, and what's the point of discussion if it's not to show the other person that you have a basis for your opinion. Regardless the discussion had turn to be some kind of fun to me because this is how this discussion sound to anyone who can analyze it better.

Your opinion: Asprika and 1 glorious effect resistance is a little better than combat asprika, cautious howard and 2 glorious ring.
My question on your point: Is asprika and 1 glorious effect resistance OP? Because I can argue that CA is not the best garment for resistance there's a reason why it has other effect other than it's only 10% resistance.
Your opinion: Combat asprika cost a lot. The changes shouldn't be done because its going to affect it's price and ruin the current combo.

Do you see how your point just  ignore the real question? Do you see how you never answer anything on point that's why I keep on saying that you never get the point at all.

Do you realize this is not a discussion regarding the effect of combat asprika, or its price and supply but the possible effect of Asprika and 1 glorious ring, on whether such combo will have crazy impact in PVP just the same way it did back in pre renewal? See how other players answer the topic here either, it's mostly regarding how glorious ring and asprika effect will have impact in PVP. Like Fasdr comment on how he believe it will work out on WoE though he didn't give an opinion regarding the usual PVP.

To be honest I can answer all your points properly but most of your points are simply too far from the main point of the topic. I am only answering it just so the other with the same mindset as you can understand a bit of it.


1-2 Prices/Supply. No, in fact it should be ignored. If the decision on whether to nerf kimi was based on it's market price before what would happen once it's price drop and it's supply increase? Everyone can claim the same back then, that Kimi is an endgame item, it has high cost. It's hard to obtain why it should be nerf? It was nerf not because of it's price nor its supply but because of it's effect. I understand if you believe that combat asprika is underwhelming but that's in fact your opinion that I don't want to further discuss because for classes that can utilize defense reduction like tanker class such as RG, I can argue that it's not that underwhelming at all. But again combat asprika is not the point of this discussion but asprika and glorious ring effect as themselves, on whether they will be OP or not. In fact that's what I am hoping to hear from other veterans, if they can argue that those 2 if combined can still cause a huge impact in PVP.

3. Even your point about Combat asprika being better than Elite asprika is in fact wrong. Combat asprika was never made to be better than elite asprika but rather to have a close to equal but different effect. It just happen that combat asprika def reduction back then is really great even for some class. To be honest the current price of combat asprika is just the result of a bad estimate. Do you really think that combat quest is supposed to be extremely difficult? I'll tell you it wasn't supposed to be like that, it was supposed to be like a regular daily quest for active PVP players. It just didn't work that way, otherwise with the number of estimated players doing it, the price of those items and supply would by now easy to obtain by public. This is also why it can be put in treasure chest woe token exchange and get cheaper and haze won't care what ever impact it does on their price.

4. Your basis for this though? I don't want to repeat what I said before, all you have is the assumption on how it will affect this and that. You aren't providing any basis for it.

although this is the one that I really want to read the most, what I need is your basis for it, what build do you think will get this effect.

If you don't mind the resistance of combat asprika and 2 glorious ring combo then how come asprika and 1 gring combo would make that huge impact considering the very small difference when it comes to resistance? You can point out the fact that they can wear 1 other accessory but as I've asked would it be OP? How?

In fact I also believe that even 99% resistance is useless at this point because whatever build i make up right now, it's only good for tanking and it's less efficient than the hybrid. That's why I pointed out how easy it is for some class to reach 99% resistance without this glorious ring. Because it's already there, it's just that it wasn't being used anymore because it's not that efficient.

What magic class would die because of it?

Warlock can dispel and napalm
Sorc can dispel too and even spam it easily.
Super novice are the class that could get impacted well by it. But ask them if they care when they are the one who are supposed to be tanky with it, there's too many things that could easily counter the class, and even if other want to reach resistance against them it's already possible, what's to QQ about it?
Ninja is the same, they are never meant to be a magical class alone, so for me the flaw in them is their broken skills. You can't argue that way if ninja physical skill is working decently because it's nothing different when an RG QQ how easy PD can be obtained in the server and how it easily counter his build. In fact I don't know who why would they need to use 4 full elemental resistance against a ninja. Most ninja spam 1-2 fatal elemental skill and if you want to counter them that's already possible now.

Now if you are telling me that it will affect magic because it will reduce it's damage dramatically, then I'll just leave it as your opinion because in my opinion, magic damage is the easiest to improve not to mention how they got lex on magic now. Also their ability to cause different statuses when using it. Silent, curse, blind, stun and as long that it hit they can potentially cause it.

Like I said, we would just be going around in circles. We have a different views. Whether my judgment is clouded or not is immaterial since it is only the admin who has the final say.

 

I think I have addressed your question about whether asprika+gring is OP. I did not say it is OP because I am not in the position to do so. First, it has not yet been implemented. Second, I think it would be better for the community or the admin to determine whether it is OP or not. What I am trying to point out is the possible effects, such as its effect to magic classes as a whole and value of CA. So in short, my answer to this question is I'm not sure if its OP, but I am sure it has negative effects on CA and magic classes. 

 

Any answer on whether it would have a crazy impact on PVP would be speculative. We won't have any basis since it is not implemented. You already provided your basis/reasons on why this suggestion should be implemented. I gave my basis/reasons why I disagree. The admin is the one who would weigh out these pros and cons. This is the reason why I refrain from making conclusions.

 

Now on the points you addressed:

1-2. I think this is not applicable here. The celine kimi issue was about a nerf. This suggestion does not request any nerf, so I think that topic is irrelevant here. Again the reason why I mentioned CA is a late game item that is hard to obtain, hard to upgrade, and expensive to buy, is because this suggestion would impact CA. I am not saying it should be the sole consideration, but it should be considered.

 

3. Your suggestion talks about "current circumstances", that is, the reason for making it unstackable is not applicable already. I think "current circumstances" should also apply to CA. Currently, it cannot be denied that CA is harder to obtain. Worst, it is even harder to upgrade to +10.

 

4. My basis is already provided in this thread. Like I said, since we are talking about a change, most would be speculative. However, I did provide some statistical basis for my speculation. Now, whether this basis is sufficient or not is up to the admin. 

 

99% resistance may be useless to you, but it works for some of us. Like I said in my earlier replies, I still use it and some of my friends does.

 

About WL, Sorcs, SN, and Ninjas. Yes, dispell can work, but it only removes the consumables. The resist of Asprika/BOP/Gring/Posei/VS/Stunic and other elemental resist items would remain. Again napalm is easily reflected by Maya. About SN, I don't know why people keeps treating SN as a handicap class. Even admin said it has a good K/D. I'm not a vet, and my SN has a good K/D. For ninja,  since your suggestion is about current situation, this also applies to ninja. Ninja can only use 3 elements.

 

Regardless, our arguments about specific characters has little value. It can never be denied that magic classes rely heavily (not solely) on the 4 magic elements. (Only ninja relies solely on 3). This is why I am pointing out that grings will affect it. So again, if the question is whether it is OP or not, I leave it to the admin. 

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Well you pretty much answer the question already, in short you can't give an opinion on whether it will be op or not more or less, you don't believe that it will be op and you only disagree for the sole reason that it will affect the CA and glorious ring combo which as I said is a pointless basis for it.

2 hours ago, ZeroGravity said:

CA is a late game item that is hard to obtain, hard to upgrade, and expensive to buy, is because this suggestion would impact CA. I am not saying it should be the sole consideration, but it should be considered.

This pretty much clarify on why this basis is pointless. You believe that CA is an end game item, hard to upgrade and expensive to buy. It also means that this kind of pointless basis will change overtime. And it cannot even be a use as a basis here because it was only made to compare the possibility of having such high resistance through normal build. The cost of this items do not matter in the first place. All that matter is it's possible.

It doesn't matter if only few can have that build, it's only either that build can be achieved and whether it's op or not.  Because in the end of the day, someone can have that build and other will soon follow, this is one of the thing that you need to understand. If it's op it should be nerfed regardless of the market value of the item or it's rarity. Those factor should never be used as a basis unless you want a ticking bomb that you'll eventually nerf once everyone can have it. That's why I ask you do you think such resistance is OP?

Now I do believe that CA and 2 glorious ring combo is in fact fine to be left as it is. I don't think anyone see it as anything OP atm.  If such combo is indirectly nerfed because glorious ring is no longer unstackable I don't see any problem with it either as they aren't supposed to be dependent with each other in the first place.

In fact the way you said it, you can't come up with a reason on why you don't want asprika and 1 glorious ring to be stacked other than the fact that it would impact the value of your combat asprika.

In fact at this point it's like you already agree that since combat asprika and 2 grings combination is not OP then the asprika and 1 glorious is not OP either and there's pretty much no reason to disagree on it, except again, you don't want it to impact the cost of your combat asprika.

More or less, all it boils down is that
you are fine for such amount of resistance to be reached easily as long that it is "expensive" or the way you called it "hard to get".  This doesn't make any sense for me as I don't see resistance build as a supposed to be an elite type of build. That build was long supposed to be cheap using asprika and glorious ring. It was only disabled because it was OP back then and since such build is pretty much accepted now, why not allow it back so more players can afford it? So again unless it is really OP there's no reason to disable it.

99% resistance is definitely useless for me but only if it's not used for tanking. As I've mentioned 99% resist is only good at tanking and a hybrid build with enough resistance is better. 

I don't see anyway where you can use 99% resist on 4 elements and actually fight back proeprly that's why I've been asking you why can't you give an example of a build where 99% resist is possible and you can actually fight back? That means your defensive build is 99% resist on 4 elements while you can actually fight back while having such resistance. To give you an example, a 99% resist build on genetic has that potential. However
another thing to consider is if such build can be amplified or made better if asprika and 1 glorious ring is added in the possibility of the build. Otherwise what's the point of discussing it, if the build can be done already with or without that combination and it won't further improve it to the point that it can be considered OP?

It won't be completely speculative if you are giving an example based on your experience considering you said it yourself that you are using 99% resist build too. In fact if you are using it why don't you give your opinion on how OP 99% resist is? It just doesn't make sense why you can't give an opinion on it considering you claim you are using the build. Is it op in PVP? Do your opponent see it as completely OP? Then perhaps it should be taken into consideration right?

The only statistical basis you gave is your computation on why you believe that asprika and 1 glorious ring combo will be better than combat asprika and 1 glorious ring when it come to resistance which is really funny considering you even ignored the fact that elite asprika was also unstackable with gring atm.
It's definitely a good statistic as it can completely show how it doesn't make any sense that combat asprika is currently kept stackable with gring considering it's potential to have higher resistance compared to elite asprika.

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1 hour ago, Xileria said:

Well you pretty much answer the question already, in short you can't give an opinion on whether it will be op or not more or less, you don't believe that it will be op and you only disagree for the sole reason that it will affect the CA and glorious ring combo which as I said is a pointless basis for it.

This pretty much clarify on why this basis is pointless. You believe that CA is an end game item, hard to upgrade and expensive to buy. It also means that this kind of pointless basis will change overtime. And it cannot even be a use as a basis here because it was only made to compare the possibility of having such high resistance through normal build. The cost of this items do not matter in the first place. All that matter is it's possible.

It doesn't matter if only few can have that build, it's only either that build can be achieved and whether it's op or not.  Because in the end of the day, someone can have that build and other will soon follow, this is one of the thing that you need to understand. If it's op it should be nerfed regardless of the market value of the item or it's rarity. Those factor should never be used as a basis unless you want a ticking bomb that you'll eventually nerf once everyone can have it. That's why I ask you do you think such resistance is OP?

Now I do believe that CA and 2 glorious ring combo is in fact fine to be left as it is. I don't think anyone see it as anything OP atm.  If such combo is indirectly nerfed because glorious ring is no longer unstackable I don't see any problem with it either as they aren't supposed to be dependent with each other in the first place.

In fact the way you said it, you can't come up with a reason on why you don't want asprika and 1 glorious ring to be stacked other than the fact that it would impact the value of your combat asprika.

In fact at this point it's like you already agree that since combat asprika and 2 grings combination is not OP then the asprika and 1 glorious is not OP either and there's pretty much no reason to disagree on it, except again, you don't want it to impact the cost of your combat asprika.

More or less, all it boils down is that
you are fine for such amount of resistance to be reached easily as long that it is "expensive" or the way you called it "hard to get".  This doesn't make any sense for me as I don't see resistance build as a supposed to be an elite type of build. That build was long supposed to be cheap using asprika and glorious ring. It was only disabled because it was OP back then and since such build is pretty much accepted now, why not allow it back so more players can afford it? So again unless it is really OP there's no reason to disable it.

99% resistance is definitely useless for me but only if it's not used for tanking. As I've mentioned 99% resist is only good at tanking and a hybrid build with enough resistance is better. 

I don't see anyway where you can use 99% resist on 4 elements and actually fight back proeprly that's why I've been asking you why can't you give an example of a build where 99% resist is possible and you can actually fight back? That means your defensive build is 99% resist on 4 elements while you can actually fight back while having such resistance. To give you an example, a 99% resist build on genetic has that potential. However
another thing to consider is if such build can be amplified or made better if asprika and 1 glorious ring is added in the possibility of the build. Otherwise what's the point of discussing it, if the build can be done already with or without that combination and it won't further improve it to the point that it can be considered OP?

It won't be completely speculative if you are giving an example based on your experience considering you said it yourself that you are using 99% resist build too. In fact if you are using it why don't you give your opinion on how OP 99% resist is? It just doesn't make sense why you can't give an opinion on it considering you claim you are using the build. Is it op in PVP? Do your opponent see it as completely OP? Then perhaps it should be taken into consideration right?

The only statistical basis you gave is your computation on why you believe that asprika and 1 glorious ring combo will be better than combat asprika and 1 glorious ring when it come to resistance which is really funny considering you even ignored the fact that elite asprika was also unstackable with gring atm.
It's definitely a good statistic as it can completely show how it doesn't make any sense that combat asprika is currently kept stackable with gring considering it's potential to have higher resistance compared to elite asprika.

It seems my reply is being taken out of context.

1. If you read my reply, the reason why I am refraining to say whether it is OP or not is because 1st, it is not yet implemented, and 2nd, the admin is in better position to determine whether it is OP or not. My role is to provide relevant information, not to be the judge of whether something it is OP or not. Like I said, while I withhold stating whether it is OP or not, my position is that there are negative effects on magic classes and CA.

 

2. I never said the price and rareness was the sole consideration. Hope you read my earlier statement.

 

3. CA+2 grings is a different case. You sacrifice 2 accessories.

 

4. About having that option only when it is expensive, that never came from me. Just read my replies and you will see that what I was saying is that this suggestion would make ca a bad alternative compared to asprika. Again sacrificing 2 accessories is a different case. Switching 1 accessory is normal, switching both is a different case.

 

5. Like I said, 99% resist might be useless to you but it works for some. Like I said it works for me. I may not be a vet, but I do have 4 chars in the top 50 HA and 2 of them are in the top 10. Again, I am still using this build and it works, so I am not sure why it is considered useless. 

 

6. I think you are equating if 99% resist is OP=asprika+gring is OP. That was never my position. I am against this because making it easier to achieve the resist would affect magic classes negatively. Now, the extent of the impact is better judged by the admin, not me. It was never denied in this thread that there is a negative effect on magic classes.

 

7. Just because I think something is OP means it is OP. The mere fact I disagree and stated the adverse effects means I am leaning towards the opinion that it might be OP. But again, I am not the judge the determine if it is. My role is to give information, not to decide.

 

8. About the statistics I provided, it was meant to show that after implementing this suggestion, asprika would be a better alternative than CA in almost every scenario. If that is your interpretation of the statistics, then I respect it. However, like I said, I leave to the admin to decide.

Edited by ZeroGravity

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54 minutes ago, ZeroGravity said:

3. CA+2 grings is a different case. You sacrifice 2 accessories.

There's so many things to quote here, but if i recall correctly, Cautious Howard Card isn't even supposed to stack with Glorious Rings in the first place. Yes, Grings may Stack with Combat Asprika, but not to Cautious Howard Card. Would you still use CA even without Cautious card? i doubt.

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This gring consider OP bcoz of how much ez it to use in PVP.. For example .

When u see magic class coming n spamming skill u can easily switch 1 acessory for 10% more nerf (tat was for gring)

For BOP when u change it u already sacrifice immune to freeze/silent and u need to use stunic too if u dun want to keep getting freeze.

so my conclusion is using BOP has it disadvantage but when u can use Gring+ Asprika i dun see any disadvantage u talk about. only when u said u sacrifice gem SW/pneuma this both item can easily switch like in 0.5 sec. Even when i fight with some1 using BOP it hard for me to kill n take longer just by using tat, n what if Gring aprrove??shud i just using Napalm Vulcan n hoping my enemy dint use Maya card or Magic Crasher the enemy till die while i getting hit by damage from melee 10k~20k each second??

 

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You can't make a judgement because it's not implemented? Do you mean to tell me that the other resistance build doesn't exist yet? That you can't give an opinion using your experience as basis. Look at how fasdr managed to do that so easily with a single comment. He gave an opinion how it might work on PVP using his experience.

You are claiming that you are using 99% resist build but you can't make a judgement on whether the addition of asprika and 1 gring in the build will make a huge change or not?

You are fine with combat asprika + 2 grings because it needs 2 accessory slot. Doesn't that basically confirm that you also agree that there's no point in making elite asprika unstackable with grings in the first place, because elite asprika has less potential in having higher resistance than combat asprika? Because the resistance potential is the main reason on why it was made impossible to stack grings.

2 hours ago, ZeroGravity said:

About having that option when it is expensive, that never came from me. Just read my replies and you will see that what I was saying is that this suggestion would make ca a bad alternative compared to asprika. 

sigh.. to be honest, you just won't understand. As I said CA was never supposed to be an alternative for asprika when in comes to resistance. In fact I am the one who suggested and designed the effect of that cautious howard and I designed it never to stack with the glorious rings back in pre renewal exactly because resistances that time can be overpowered.

I never pointed it out because I find it unnecessary to be fixed in renewal. But if you want to confirm what Seam said here it is.


 


Cautious Howard [MANTEAU]

Reduce long range attacks by 10%

Increase resistance to all elements by 1% each refine.

0.50% to inflict "Bleeding" on the enemy when using physical attacks/skills.

(Does not stack with glorious rings)



I want to confirm from vets if CA and cautious is fine stacking with glorious ring. If they are fine from it I have more reason to believe that the unstacking of asprika/e asprika and gring is also pointless. Even though it may come with restriction like limiting the gring from stacking it still better to keep it working. Most players do not lack damage, they lack option for better resistance builds.

And again 99% resistance in 4 basic element is useless for me when it comes to making a build that could actually fight back while having so much resistance. If it's used is for tanking which is what it is supposed to be then I believe that it would work just fine because that's exactly how it is supposed to work. In short I only believe that resistance build is OP if it's easy to achieve without sacrificing much your ability to fight back.
 

I am answering your opinion and asking you to specify it because you claimed that it will affect magic classes like this and like that, but you never gave any clarification on your answers, all you did is to make an assumption on how it would affect magic classes which is pretty much why I said I want to hear a basis for it. As a dev how am I supposed to decide whether this thing would made an impact or not if everyone just give opinions without clear clarifications? Don't you realize that anyone can claim here that it will kill magic classes etc etc? And without proper analysis on why that player believe it will be the case there won't be any progress on it either.

I created the topic so I can answer those concerns and perhaps get a better idea on whether this things should be implemented or not, or maybe there's another way to do it. I didn't make this topic to wait for admin's opinion because Haze don't PVP either and it's player who experience PVP better than him. As a dev I could easily bring this to the admin and ask for his opinion, but his opinion is not what I believe to be necessary right now. I am not afraid that he would disagree would it, as I don't really care about this topic that much either in fact I am more worried that he agree on it while I still doubt whether it's really fine or not.
 

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1 hour ago, Seam said:

There's so many things to quote here, but if i recall correctly, Cautious Howard Card isn't even supposed to stack with Glorious Rings in the first place. Yes, Grings may Stack with Combat Asprika, but not to Cautious Howard Card. Would you still use CA even without Cautious card? i doubt.

This one i’m not sure. But if cautious cannot be used with ca, the instances I would use CA is lesser.

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51 minutes ago, Xileria said:

You can't make a judgement because it's not implemented? Do you mean to tell me that the other resistance build doesn't exist yet? That you can't give an opinion using your experience as basis. Look at how fasdr managed to do that so easily with a single comment. He gave an opinion how it might work on PVP using his experience.

You are claiming that you are using 99% resist build but you can't make a judgement on whether the addition of asprika and 1 gring in the build will make a huge change or not?

You are fine with combat asprika + 2 grings because it needs 2 accessory slot. Doesn't that basically confirm that you also agree that there's no point in making elite asprika unstackable with grings in the first place, because elite asprika has less potential in having higher resistance than combat asprika? Because the resistance potential is the main reason on why it was made impossible to stack grings.

sigh.. to be honest, you just won't understand. As I said CA was never supposed to be an alternative for asprika when in comes to resistance. In fact I am the one who suggested and designed the effect of that cautious howard and I designed it never to stack with the glorious rings back in pre renewal exactly because resistances that time can be overpowered.

I never pointed it out because I find it unnecessary to be fixed in renewal. But if you want to confirm what Seam said here it is.


 


Cautious Howard [MANTEAU]

Reduce long range attacks by 10%

Increase resistance to all elements by 1% each refine.

0.50% to inflict "Bleeding" on the enemy when using physical attacks/skills.

(Does not stack with glorious rings)



I want to confirm from vets if CA and cautious is fine stacking with glorious ring. If they are fine from it I have more reason to believe that the unstacking of asprika/e asprika and gring is also pointless. Even though it may come with restriction like limiting the gring from stacking it still better to keep it working. Most players do not lack damage, they lack option for better resistance builds.

And again 99% resistance in 4 basic element is useless for me when it comes to making a build that could actually fight back while having so much resistance. If it's used is for tanking which is what it is supposed to be then I believe that it would work just fine because that's exactly how it is supposed to work. In short I only believe that resistance build is OP if it's easy to achieve without sacrificing much your ability to fight back.
 

I am answering your opinion and asking you to specify it because you claimed that it will affect magic classes like this and like that, but you never gave any clarification on your answers, all you did is to make an assumption on how it would affect magic classes which is pretty much why I said I want to hear a basis for it. As a dev how am I supposed to decide whether this thing would made an impact or not if everyone just give opinions without clear clarifications? Don't you realize that anyone can claim here that it will kill magic classes etc etc? And without proper analysis on why that player believe it will be the case there won't be any progress on it either.

I created the topic so I can answer those concerns and perhaps get a better idea on whether this things should be implemented or not, or maybe there's another way to do it. I didn't make this topic to wait for admin's opinion because Haze don't PVP either and it's player who experience PVP better than him. As a dev I could easily bring this to the admin and ask for his opinion, but his opinion is not what I believe to be necessary right now. I am not afraid that he would disagree would it, as I don't really care about this topic that much either in fact I am more worried that he agree on it while I still doubt whether it's really fine or not.
 

Like I said, you are equating 99% resist not OP=asprika+gring not OP. The suggestion that I am opposing is not having 99% resist, but to have an easier option to achieve it, that is this suggestion, making Grings stackable with asprika. I already mentioned my reasons why I disagree. However, it would be premature for me to say whether this suggestion would be OP or not. Rather, I provided my basis in disagreeing. 

 

Like @Merong Mahawangsa said, sacrificing an accessory is not as crucial or fatal than sacrificing a lower headgear as in the case of BOP. Based on your suggestion, you only sacrifice 1 accessory. For CA to have just a similar resist you need to sacrifice 2 accessory. Hence, you can put your GOP/GOSW in one accessory that isn't sacrificed. In CA's case, you can't because you need to sacrifice both. When switching comes to equation, it's even more evident. 

 

99% resist is useless for you, but again, it works for me and some other people. 

 

You already mentioned, resistance build could be OP if it is easy to achieve without sacrificing much your ability to fight back. While sacrificing 1 accessory is not a lot for me, it may be a lot for you. This is the reason why I don't want to conclude it is OP. Rather, I wanted to lay down the effects and scenarios that this suggestion could mean.

 

Well, if this gets approved by the admin, I would accept and respect it. Again, my only role is to provide information based on my pvp experience. For the past 10-11 months, I have been very active in PVP. If my opinions are wrong, then I would gladly admit it and accept it. But for now, my position is still I disagree. 

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4 hours ago, Merong Mahawangsa said:

This gring consider OP bcoz of how much ez it to use in PVP.. For example .

When u see magic class coming n spamming skill u can easily switch 1 acessory for 10% more nerf (tat was for gring)

For BOP when u change it u already sacrifice immune to freeze/silent and u need to use stunic too if u dun want to keep getting freeze.

so my conclusion is using BOP has it disadvantage but when u can use Gring+ Asprika i dun see any disadvantage u talk about. only when u said u sacrifice gem SW/pneuma this both item can easily switch like in 0.5 sec. Even when i fight with some1 using BOP it hard for me to kill n take longer just by using tat, n what if Gring aprrove??shud i just using Napalm Vulcan n hoping my enemy dint use Maya card or Magic Crasher the enemy till die while i getting hit by damage from melee 10k~20k each second??

 

Well this one makes more sense as this is more direct to the point.

I understand your concern but to be honest aren't those things already possible? And it doesn't need the approval of gring stacking to asprika because such amount of resistance is there already.

In fact countering warlock do not even need 4 elemental resistance, for 2nd it's mostly fire/water only. And having high resistance on those 2 elements are pretty easy eitherway. What I want to understand is whether it would be improved to the point that it's unacceptable.

Since no one is doing it, I guess I should make an example of a build.

Elements   Fire /  Water / Wind / Earth / Ghost
Asprika      30      30         30      30      30
Stunic       20       0          20      20      20
Valky Sh   20      20          0         0       0
Und Scr    20      20         20      20      0
Res pot     0        20       -15       0       0
BOP         10      10          10      10     0
-------------------------------------------------------
Total       100    100         65    80       50

Basically I believe that this build is enough to produce the same result?

That build have 3 card slot available in headgear. You can use mavka wings to add wind resistance and other bonuses including -30% acd. any card is available for shield and you can switch with it too. They can switch to demi human for sure. They are free to use whatever upper headgear they want and have crazy demi human resistance basically making them tanky regardless.

More or less my point here is simple. This build already exist and it's enough to cripple a warlock, your concern doesn't need the approval of grings so I don't need to answer those questions regarding what you should do against those that will counter warlock with resistances because that problem already exist. Unless you want to discuss it in another topic and ask for nerfs on those perhaps we can talk about it there.


Though if your worry is because gring will make that build easier to do, then that's a good point to consider though in my defense I don't really think there will be much difference if that BOP is replaced by anything because 90% resistance to those 2 elements as well as with the addition of high demi human resistance is more than enough to dominate a warlock in 2nd.

And there are other way to replace BOP if you only want elemental resistances on those 2. Ring of flame lord give 10% resistance on fire so you can keep your fire resistance at 99% (capped). 1 of your accessory is also consumed. You can use poseidon shoes to have additional resistance on water which will give you a total of 98% resistance on water. a 1% resistance below cap. Does it make much difference for warlock? to be honest I don't know?  Though again there's a lot of way to cripple warlock that no one needs gring to do that. So I don't really see much difference in making 1 of it stack or not.

I hope that it doesn't sound like I don't care on warlocks. It's nothing like that, we just probably have different opinion on warlocks role as a class. I also believe that it's normal that a build will counter you and if they can counter you, you can counter them too.

I can give other example like through +10 CA but again it might get nerf anyway since it's pretty much stated that Cautious was never supposed to work with GRs.


Also how about elite asprika? If you believe that asprika and gring combo will make things harder for you How about the elite asprika?

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