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Xadsyath

PvP Balancing Discussion

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INTRODUCTION

Original post (link here) was closed as HaZe requested each suggestion to be discussed in separate post for me to scam +1.

 

For those who know me, you know me. For those who do not, I am a veteran asshole in DRO who should be given a medal for my mates and I had dominated PvP longer than anyone else in DRO history even after being absent for more than 4 years now today. We also shaped the culture of competitive PvP which focused on teamwork before it deteriorated into the solo / suicide gameplay we are having nowadays, many of the veterans would agree on both statements while some, who hate / hated me, would at least agree on the later statement.

As a give-back to DRO for so many wonderful years I had had with so many friends I made along the way, I decided to help to do a little in giving suggestions which I genuinely think would help the server as a whole because I always believe that (btw when I say I believe I mean it's a fucking fact) PvP serves as one of the backbones along side with PvE to make Ragnarok shine as one of the most successful MMORPG. PvP is the core of any PK related activities such as BG & WOE, while PvE is the core of other functions such as instances, quests, collectibles, etc.

TLDR, Purposes of this post:

  1. Serve as a log for me to write down what I am observing and going to test.
  2. To collect information especially on what class / item / skill to be reviewed from public as I received feedback on many OP shits after renewal and some were fixed while some were not. Please try to be as details as you can be, credit will be given to those who suggested.
  3. I no longer have access to large number of peers that can assist me in testing everything, so if you wanna help me test shits, look for me in 18. 

Note:

  1. I expect people QQing on my suggestions. But fuck you thank you. Only constructive comments will be entertained.
  2. I have no intention nor incentive to favor or against any class or guild, reason is simple: I had not played since renewal - not a single war, not a single WOE, not a single BG, not a single PVP event, all my known friends and enemies quit, and most importantly I may remain quit after the the pandemic. 

 

OBSERVATIONS & ITEMS PENDING REVIEW

*Please let me know which item/skill/class I should review. I will be focusing on the 2nd job before the 3rd jobs because 3rd is much more complicated in nature, and 2nd is the backbone of everything. But you may still suggest and I will do it at my convenient time, BEFORE I QUIT AGAIN LOL

  1. Sinx Grimtooth & 1 handed katar (tested: est 300k on standard gears, spammable, need to observe the practicality and new def)
  2. WKC & KKC  (tested: need more information, need volunteer with 4 WKC)
  3. Sorc underpowered in current META due to lack of killing skills and key skill dispel being usable by WL and AB (need more observation)
  4. Asura Strike (tested: est 1.2m on standard gears, need to observe the practicality and new def, need volunteers with full gears)
  5. Overall lack of survival capability of all classes due to implementations of cards and gears that significantly boost damage

*Damage taken based on standard defensive gears, my definition of standard gears - Asprika with 30% all elements + 65% demi human resist

 

SUGGESTIONS MADE

  1. THANATOS CARD / DEF (link) - Accepted, shall monitor the result public please pay attention to RGs)
  2. KIMI CELINE CARD (link) - Accepted
  3. PRIEST RE-BALANCING (link
  4. LUK (link)
  5. NINJA BALANCING (link(Credit: Wyio/Pan)
  6. PVP REWARD & MAP REVAMP (link)

 

REMOVED FROM OBSERVATION / REJECTED 

  1. Auto SB gear (Credit: Seamless) - Removed, previously doing LV70 SB due to wrong script, fixed per 7/5/2020 changlog
  2. Genetic Sling (Credit: Imminent) - Removed, effect modified per 7/5/2020 changelog, to revisit if new effects are still OP
  3. Gunslinger Rapid Shower / Full Buster (Credit: PattyAnn) - Removed,  RS doing 20k x 5 spammable with full damage gears, 13k x 5 spammable using defensive gears | FB doing 200k with full damage gears and 130k using defensive gears, both with fixed delay | Verdict: damage is OP only on full damage gears, which they have to give up Shield and Garment and take shitload of damage in return, given their HP it would make them dead in less than 2 seconds, despite my non-preference of the popular-nowadays suicide gameplay, I have to agree that this is a fair trade off.
  4. Ranger SS (Removed) - 200k damage spam on standard gears is only doable when the ranger is using full damage gears which include garment, shield, and breakable armor. Replacing all 3 of them to defensive gears such as Asprika / Thara in VS / any unbreakable armor the damage will be lowered to est 100k to 120k. Despite the damage is still very damaging looking at its spread damage and spam speed, after observing this in 3 mid to big wars in PvP: rangers who were doing full offensive SS died too easily / those who were using defensive gears but only SS had range constraint due to the skill range limit, which resulted them into trapping and DS instead of just SS. Verdict: damage and spam are really OP in full offensive gears, however, just like GS, it's not practical to play it without proper supports which include a devo RG and a priest to focus on the range, whereas when they are in standard defensive gears the damage is still very good with spread damage but it also puts them into skill casting range of any magic / range classes. Again, not a fan of suicide gameplay, but have to agree that the cost of going full offensive is a fair trade off. Removed from observation until further notice.
Edited by Xadsyath
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10 minutes ago, Xadsyath said:

I had dominated PvP longer than anyone else in DRO history

Hello, not as long as I live haha. Greetings :th_kis:.

I'd say that review GS damage Full Buster/Rapid Shower

 

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why sinx goin to have nerf again when its easily countered  this with pneuma gem or can be sight easy and since auto sb hat have been nerf to the extent of being useless gx is goin to be useless to the point no one will use that char.... 

 

Dont give me the BS that katar made one hand when bow and staffs is one hand also....

Edited by GhostAlpha1

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So yesterday, auto sb headgears finally got a nerf but it was overkill I think. What does everyone think about it? Personally i'd say that auto sb headgears that gives demi human reduction should have only level 10 auto sonic blow and the rest that don't give reduction should remain as it was for obvious reasons. Instances farmers are heavily affected by this since they're relying so hard on it. I get it, no one should be able to solo it easily but the gears needed for the instances are expensive and not easily obtained. I suggest that we should have the level 70 sonic blow on auto sb gears that give no reduction since they're easily killed in PvP but is very helpful in PvE.

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2 minutes ago, Imminent said:

So yesterday, auto sb headgears finally got a nerf but it was overkill I think. What does everyone think about it? Personally i'd say that auto sb headgears that gives demi human reduction should have only level 10 auto sonic blow and the rest that don't give reduction should remain as it was for obvious reasons. Instances farmers are heavily affected by this since they're relying so hard on it. I get it, no one should be able to solo it easily but the gears needed for the instances are expensive and not easily obtained. I suggest that we should have the level 70 sonic blow on auto sb gears that give no reduction since they're easily killed in PvP but is very helpful in PvE.


Definitly upvote, I'd say only the ones with reduction for PvP, the others used for PvE should've stayed the same.

 

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13 minutes ago, GhostAlpha1 said:

why sinx goin to have nerf again when its easily countered  this with pneuma gem or can be sight easy and since auto sb hat have been nerf to the extent of being useless gx is goin to be useless to the point no one will use that char.... 

 

Dont give me the BS that katar made one hand when bow and staffs is one hand also....

Can you tell me exactly which part did GX get a nerf? I only saw GX getting a boost with cross impact and honestly that is way too good since it would open up more ways for GX to fight. If you think GX is now useless because you can't kill without auto SB then you should just quit playing the class. Anyone who fully relies on auto sb sucks anyways, no offense.

Edited by Imminent
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1 minute ago, Imminent said:

So yesterday, auto sb headgears finally got a nerf but it was overkill I think. What does everyone think about it? Personally i'd say that auto sb headgears that gives demi human reduction should have only level 10 auto sonic blow and the rest that don't give reduction should remain as it was for obvious reasons. Instances farmers are heavily affected by this since they're relying so hard on it. I get it, no one should be able to solo it easily but the gears needed for the instances are expensive and not easily obtained. I suggest that we should have the level 70 sonic blow on auto sb gears that give no reduction since they're easily killed in PvP but is very helpful in PvE.

i got a few ideas

1. put back the level 67 sonic blow for Punk Beanie, Candy Wrap and etc but disable the effect in PvP areas like BG/WoE/HA/3rds/HHH(PK ON) etc..
2. put back the level 67 sonic blow for Punk Beanie, Candy Wrap and etc but add the effect of  "receive 50% more damage from demi-humans"  to discourage it's use in PvP

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1 minute ago, Seamless said:

i got a few ideas

1. put back the level 67 sonic blow for Punk Beanie, Candy Wrap and etc but disable the effect in PvP areas like BG/WoE/HA/3rds/HHH(PK ON) etc..
2. put back the level 67 sonic blow for Punk Beanie, Candy Wrap and etc but add the effect of  "receive 50% more damage from demi-humans"  to discourage it's use in PvP

I think the nerf of the headgear wasn't necessary at all cause Safety Gem has pretty much ruined autosb chances to kill just like Gem of Pneuma, those Gems are kinda ruining the PvP, they're spammed a lot and in case of BG, you can luckily deal an autosb and good luck cause people heal due to the lots of SW casted.

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6 minutes ago, Imminent said:

Can you tell me exactly which part did GX get a nerf? I only saw GX getting a boost with cross impact and honestly that is way too good since it would open up more ways to GX to fight. If you think GX is now useless because you can't kill without auto SB then you should just quit playing the class. Anyone who fully relies on auto sb sucks anyways, no offense.

am not talking about autosb hat am talking about grimtooth.... Look at thats list of yours...

Edited by GhostAlpha1

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1 minute ago, GhostAlpha1 said:

am not talking about autosb hat am talking about grimtooth.... Look at thats list of yours...

 

15 minutes ago, GhostAlpha1 said:

why sinx goin to have nerf again when its easily countered  this with pneuma gem or can be sight easy and since auto sb hat have been nerf to the extent of being useless gx is goin to be useless to the point no one will use that char.... 

 

Dont give me the BS that katar made one hand when bow and staffs is one hand also....

tell me which part exactly you're talking about grimtooth. I'm so clueless

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6 minutes ago, Seamless said:

i got a few ideas

1. put back the level 67 sonic blow for Punk Beanie, Candy Wrap and etc but disable the effect in PvP areas like BG/WoE/HA/3rds/HHH(PK ON) etc..
2. put back the level 67 sonic blow for Punk Beanie, Candy Wrap and etc but add the effect of  "receive 50% more damage from demi-humans"  to discourage it's use in PvP

leave autosb hat since its that what you want no more instaces/mvp crit lcoking auto sb no more farming using gx 

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2 minutes ago, Imminent said:

 

tell me which part exactly you're talking about grimtooth. I'm so clueless

Sinx Grimtooth & 1 handed katar (tested: est 300k on standard gears, spammable, need to observe the practicality and new def)

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2 minutes ago, GhostAlpha1 said:

leave autosb hat since its that what you want no more instaces/mvp crit lcoking auto sb no more farming using gx 

changing the damage of sonic blow in bosses or monsters can be easily done if that's the only thing that needed it, it's just that our admin do not approve of the idea atm . The changes are still under observation.

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2 minutes ago, Irish Heart said:

changing the damage of sonic blow in bosses or monsters can be easily done if that's the only thing that needed it, it's just that our admin do not approve of the idea atm . The changes are still under observation.

Yeah we want that for instance/MVP farming pretty much.

Edited by PattyAnn

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auto sb hat is being abuse by other class why not make it ASSASSIN CLASS EXCLUSISE since assasins are more fragile than other class 

2 minutes ago, Irish Heart said:

changing the damage of sonic blow in bosses or monsters can be easily done if that's the only thing that needed it, it's just that our admin do not approve of the idea atm . The changes are still under observation.

 

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34 minutes ago, Imminent said:

About time for asura to get a nerf. I'll gladly volunteer for it

Do you have 4 WKCs?

24 minutes ago, GhostAlpha1 said:

why sinx goin to have nerf again when its easily countered  this with pneuma gem or can be sight easy and since auto sb hat have been nerf to the extent of being useless gx is goin to be useless to the point no one will use that char.... 

 

Dont give me the BS that katar made one hand when bow and staffs is one hand also....

You need to live in the era when sinx was played by top tier players. They raped everyone in 1v1 when they had katars with no shield. They played with shield switch, backslide, throw knife, status, drill katar strips, frozen and Venom dust. I do not see that anymore. I only see sinx's nowadays with braindead melee or use only 1 or 2 skills. 

The reason why bow is entitled to have a shield is that their charge arrow got fucked by Libra. And they have to give up Asprika to use cloak. While sinx are still enjoying endless backslide which is very good if you know how to bingbing bangbang, and can use Asprika 24/7 with access to Combat knife + shield to backslide + cloak to healer. Their only vulnerable time was when they are in katar and too slow to switch and move to safe gears/zone, which 1 hand katar took it away.

I hope you can understand that was the primary reason why veterans are very sceptical on 1 hand katar. 

However on fair judgement basis, I do think the katar should have at least 15% demi due to the fact that everything else was boosted which would put sinx at a very disadvantageous spot, but giving a one handed katar is still too much for me. 

Gear me a sinx I will abuse it with bingbang backslide +q2 katar Combat knife raping everyone with gromtooth and fly around like an annoying fly. 

But first of all please calm down I haven't proposed a Nerf. 

Edited by Xadsyath
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5 minutes ago, GhostAlpha1 said:

auto sb hat is being abuse by other class why not make it ASSASSIN CLASS EXCLUSISE since assasins are more fragile than other class 

 

Being abuse? I don't think so, the only job using autosb hat besides sinx is Taekwon... the other classes pretty much use it to farm Caspen Kills and those are newbies so I wouldn't say abouse.

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13 minutes ago, GhostAlpha1 said:

ive played 2 hand katar before also been swtiching gears here in there i know what its like playin gx with katar...

open your mind, everytime i read your comment everything is about "why GX nerfed". Your comments are so bias to GX. you are not the only one playing GX.

Please speak using universal and logical words. Thanks you so much.

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1 hour ago, Seamless said:

i got a few ideas

1. put back the level 67 sonic blow for Punk Beanie, Candy Wrap and etc but disable the effect in PvP areas like BG/WoE/HA/3rds/HHH(PK ON) etc..
2. put back the level 67 sonic blow for Punk Beanie, Candy Wrap and etc but add the effect of  "receive 50% more damage from demi-humans"  to discourage it's use in PvP

Basically I agree with this idea since Auto SB headgear done great help cultivating newbies as this help a lot on their  farming activities avoiding them left behind and getting bored then quit. Pro Players find this benefiting but they spend hard works and zenies for their set if they are using this for instances.

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Stop wasting your time discussing the lvl 63 or lvl 70 sonic blow. Its not going to come back.

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Im still farming intance using Gx,and i can finish it w/o any problem,even w/o autosb headgear.

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Removed Genetic & Auto SB per 7/5/2020 changelog and Haze's comment.

Added GS to pending test.

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